Wealthy After Divorce

S2EP4: Breaking Free from Financial Abuse with Stacy Francis

• Melissa Fradenburg, CDFA® and Jacki Roessler, CDFA® • Season 2 • Episode 4

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Have you ever felt powerless in your financial life, or worried that someone close to you may be taking advantage of your money? We're here to help you recognize and overcome financial abuse. In this episode,  Jacki Roessler, CDFA talks with  Stacy Francis, CFP, CDFA, CES, president and CEO of Francis Financial and founder of Savvy Ladies, who shares her personal experience growing up with a grandmother who suffered from physical, emotional, and financial abuse. Together, we discuss the red flags of financial abuse, what steps to take if you suspect you're a victim, and how to reclaim your financial power.

**This episode contains a content warning. Among the topics discussed are financial abuse and domestic violence. These topics can be upsetting. Please use self-care and caution to decide if you want to consume this content.**

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https://francisfinancial.com/blog-posts/financial-abuse-the-most-common-type-of-abuse-that-far-too-many-ignore/

Speaker 1:

Welcome to the Wealthy After Divorce podcast. Jackie Ressler, a divorce financial planner with almost 25 years experience, and myself, melissa Freidenberg, financial advisor with Pearl Planning. We are both certified divorce financial analysts and your co-hosts.

Speaker 2:

If you're thinking about divorce or in the process of divorce, this is a time for you to take a deep breath and give yourself permission to gain clarity on the financial decision they're facing, while the term wealth typically refers to money and possessions.

Speaker 1:

We know that truly being wealthy means a whole lot more Together with our guests on this podcast. We will help you live wealthy after divorce.

Speaker 2:

Hey everyone, welcome back to the Wealthy After Divorce podcast. This is Jackie Ressler, and my guest today is Stacey Francis, who is the president and CEO of Francis Financial and the founder of Savvy Ladies, which we're going to be talking about in this episode, stacey I've known of Stacey's work for a long time. She is incredibly well known and renowned in the divorce financial planning field and in financial planning. She's authored two books. The first is unveiling the unspoken truth about financial issues and divorce, and she has a new book out on financial resources for widows. So again, we are so lucky to have Stacey. She is a wealth of information and she's been featured on numerous national publications and TV shows, so again, i'm very grateful to have her here today.

Speaker 2:

Welcome, stacey. Thank you, it's great to be here, jackie, we are. I'm really excited to talk about our topic today because it affects so many people that are considering divorce and many people that are in the process of the divorce and those that are recovering from divorce. So today we're going to be talking about financial abuse and what that is, how to recognize if you are a victim of financial abuse, what red flags to look out for and also some ways that you can begin to take control back. So, stacey, i know that this is an area that is near and dear to your heart, this topic. Can you talk a little bit about how you got into this area?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, i have to say, you know, most little girls don't think that they are going to do the work that I do every day, but I grew up watching someone who I so cared about, my grandmother, who was just so close to my heart And she was in a physically, emotional and also financial abusive relationship with my grandfather. And it played out in front of my eyes to really see this amazing woman be mistreated on so many levels and in so many ways And it really changes you as a little girl to see how individuals can be hurt And I really desperately wanted to save my grandmother. Unfortunately, none of us can save people. They need to save themselves.

Speaker 3:

But for her in particular, it was very difficult because, again, not only physically abusive but emotionally, and what we're going to be talking about today financially abusive, and that financially abusive. I really love that we're going to be shedding a light on that, because it can trap individuals in really unhealthy relationships, really strapping them down and not allowing them to break a free from the difficult situation that they're in. So that's why I come to this work with such passion And for me it's a mission that I will just never give up, because everyone deserves to have a safe relationship where they are feeling safe not only from a financial and emotional point of view, but of course, also a physical point of view.

Speaker 2:

Of course, absolutely. Over the years I have found working with clients more than anything that I've dealt with is not so much physical abuse, but I have had so many clients sitting in front of me and they describe situations that to me it's very clear that they've been emotionally and financially abused throughout their relationship. But they don't see it that way And for a lot of people they feel like it's normal, especially if they are the lower wage earner or they are a stay-at-home parent. That was agreed upon between the couple. How can somebody recognize in your experience if they might be a victim of financial abuse and what are some of the red flags?

Speaker 3:

There are a lot of reg of flags, and so, all of you listening, i want you to think about your situation and also the dear people that you love.

Speaker 3:

Financial abuse doesn't happen overnight. It tends to be a slow progression where someone is trying to control you and how they're using and exhibiting their control is often through money. So maybe controlling how you access money, whether or not you have visibility into all of the finances of the marriage, potentially restricting your access to bank accounts or passwords, maybe even opening up debt, such as a home equity line of credit, forging your name, opening a credit card in your name without your permission and using it, and sometimes this is done covertly. Sometimes it's actually done right out in the in front of you as well. There are so many red flags that again can show you that guess what? this isn't a healthy financial relationship. Someone is trying to control the other person by either restricting their access to money, putting them on a budget that is not even livable, or potentially even carving them completely out of any knowledge about, again, the financial situation of that relationship in marriage.

Speaker 2:

Right, and I mean all of those things that you described. I hear all day long from different people at varying degrees. What do you recommend? So, if someone is sitting down in front of you and they tell you they think that they are a victim of financial abuse, what are some things that they can do to start to take some control before they consider the idea of divorce? So let's say that it's someone that wants to remain in the marriage or isn't sure what they want. But what can they do to protect themselves?

Speaker 3:

as a starting point, Yeah, And I love that you share. You know what to do if someone says I think I'm a victim of financial abuse. You may hear that, But you also may not hear that Often people don't they don't identify as victims of financial abuse, And also, when we're talking about that, typically we try to talk about it as survivors of actually the answering to this question of you know being able to take a proactive step to protect them yourself. And so one of the best things you can do is reach out to what you were speaking about a trusted family member, a friend, a coach, a therapist, maybe even attorney to understand your rights, to get that second person to validate how you're feeling, Because if you are wondering, is this okay, My friends' relationships with their husband don't look like this, Most likely there is a problem. And again, talking to that trusted person will give you that feedback, that encouragement that you might need to. You know, really face the situation, And the other thing you can do in a very concrete way, too, is start to keep records of financial records, as much information as you possibly can have about the finances of your marriage.

Speaker 3:

The more information and knowledge you'll have to be able to make a good decision about number one. You know what do the finances look like? What will it look like if I do leave, if we do get a divorce? What are the things I need to be doing to make sure that I'm prepared? And so it's that knowledge about the finances that's really important, And it may even be starting to prepare yourself. Maybe you might need to go back to work, or you may take the career that you have right now and need to take it up a notch or two too, so that you're being thoughtful with not only from a support point of view, but also from a financial knowledge and ability to earn in the future.

Speaker 2:

I love those ideas. I think in my experience too, it's really important that people get legal advice, because so many people that sit down in front of me they might find this on the internet or they find this through a friend and they call up and they tell me I have no idea what our income is. My spouse has signed the tax returns with the numbers covered. I get a certain amount of money. My spouse just all of a sudden took over the finances and didn't tell me why and restricted my access to everything. Or my spouse inherited money. I have no idea what they inherited and I'm completely out of the loop.

Speaker 2:

To me, i really feel like getting some information and education about what is marital property in the state that I'm in, how a spouse will support, could work. Just that basic information that you can get from an attorney that, i think, gives people some idea of what their rights should be or what they look like. Do you find that when you're sitting down with do most of your clients, when they are in this situation, do they come to you first or do they come to the lawyer first?

Speaker 3:

It's a great question. We do find quite a few clients come to us before they hire the lawyer. It's usually because the financial piece about leaving is so significant for them that that is actually having a big bearing on whether or not they end up with a legal separation or a divorce. Going to a certified divorce financial analyst feels safer that they're not getting on a steam train that is going to go and barrel down the tracks and they're not going to be able to stop it and the next stop is going to be divorce. For us, we tend to be really the frontline people where we can help from a point of view of knowledge and empowerment around the finances so that she or he because financial abuse does happen to I will tell you we have clients, both men and women very much that they have more information to make these good decisions and also the timing of those decisions.

Speaker 3:

What I also really just want to say too, is that financial abuse, again, it's using money to control people, but it also can often escalate into physical abuse, as in the case of my grandmother. If you are feeling unsafe, make sure that you reach out to either Safe Horizon you can call the Domestic Violence Hotline. It's 1-800-799 and the word Safe, So 1-800-799-SAFE. We have worked with quite a few clients where it was just emotional and financial abuse and then there was some type of heated issue. Something came to a head and unfortunately it became physical And my grandmother lost her life because of that. And you do want to make sure that of course you want to leave in a way that you can afford to do so, but there are times when, just from a physical standpoint, you have to leave, no matter what.

Speaker 2:

Right, absolutely. That's very good advice, And I'm sure that some people don't recognize some of those warning signs when it gets to that point. So I would encourage anyone who is listening to this or who feels like they know someone in that situation or that they might be in that situation. it's worthwhile to reach out to get some help as soon as you can, even if you think that maybe you don't. your situation is not going to turn into that. any sign of it, i think, needs to be taken seriously. Let's talk a little bit about Savi Ladies, so tell me about how that started and what kind of help people can find through that resource.

Speaker 3:

You're so kind to ask Savi Ladies is a big part of who I am as a person. It is a charity that I started when I wanted to make sure that no other woman went through the same experience that I saw my grandmother suffer with, and it really is my love letter to her. I started the charity when I was 26, and the great news about being 26 is you have a lot of energy Right And, quite frankly, i didn't really know what I was getting into, but boy was I passionate, and I still am Here. We are well over two decades later and Savi Ladies continues to do the great work that we did even back then, but even more so. So, going to the website, saviladiesorg and two Vs There's two Vs in Savi because it's very, very good You'll see that there are hundreds of FINRA approved self-paced courses that you can take, hundreds of TED Talk like videos on every financial topic you can imagine.

Speaker 3:

We are going to be launching a financial abuse seminar series that will be on the website And if you need that help of one-on-one support to really understand how does this relate to my individual situation? We have over 230 certified financial planners, cpas many of them trained in financial abuse, to help answer any questions that you might have, and it's all free of charge.

Speaker 3:

And so you get to work one-on-one with an expert in your field. These are people who love what they do. They want to help and it's their way of giving back. And anyone can reach out to Savi Ladies. We don't income test, it's for any woman who has the question, just like my grandmother would have. I want to make sure that there is this resource for everyone, wherever you are, and you don't have to be in a difficult relationship. You could be an amazing woman just graduating college, starting her career and wondering how do I balance my bill for paying off my school student loan debt, or should I be putting that towards an emergency fund? or maybe even putting money into that 401k that I have at my new job? that gives me a match. So all of those questions and more is what the Savvy Ladies Helpline is for.

Speaker 2:

That's fantastic And it's available to anyone, no matter what state they live in.

Speaker 3:

Right, that's Yes, we have women who come to us from all 50 states, actually around the world, and it's been fantastic. We now are matching over 5,000 women who are financially vulnerable, who are struggling to find the financial answers they need each year. So, boy, it's really grown from when I had 12 women in my Upper East Side apartment, crammed in our tiny little living room with my homemade food and my cats sitting on each one of them their laps. Thank goodness, no one was allergic to where we are now, but the heart and the care that we've always had is definitely still there.

Speaker 2:

That's amazing, and I did take a peek at the website and it has some amazing resources just done even on basic financial issues that I think women tend to struggle with. So, putting retirement first, how to create a budget, i mean just some really fantastic resources And I would highly encourage anyone listening to check it out and see what they might be useful to them or someone that they know. And then you've also written a couple books. Can you tell us a little bit about each one of those and what those are helping people?

Speaker 3:

Of course I love to. I had so much joy writing these. The first was a book for women who are thinking about going through and after divorce. That is one of the superpowers of the types of women we work with here at Francis Financial, and we interviewed 150 women who have gone through divorce and we asked them what would you tell your girlfriend? What did you do right, but do you wish that you had done differently? How did you find that perfect lawyer? Was that not a perfect lawyer? And what recommendations would you give? Did you work with a financial? And so it's a fantastic book.

Speaker 3:

You can go right on the francesfinancialcom website and download it for free. It's right on the home page. Oh great, yep. And it's called Unveiling the Unspoken Truth The Financial Challenges Women Face During and After Divorce. And then my COVID project was a widow's resource guide that I created. Our other superpower is working with women whose husbands either her partners have a terminal illness or unfortunately, unfortunately have passed away, and we find that there's just a lot of financial topics that women are forced to face many times for the first time, dealing with their finances on their own, and we really wanted to create a guide that broke that down into small little steps, timeframes, with the information and support that she needs to feel that she's on track to be financially secure, even though her partner, unfortunately, has passed away.

Speaker 2:

Right, And so many women are in that position because women obviously live longer than men statistically And with the divorce rates being what it is, most many women are going to end up at some point handling their own finances.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I was reading a statistic, Jackie, and it's amazing eight out of 10 women at one point in our lives. We are going to be 100% responsible for our own finances, So the odds are 80% of us, however. That is, whether it's a divorce, or our partner becomes disabled or they pass away. We're going to be on our own.

Speaker 2:

Right, and so we need to be informed. Is there anything else, stacy, that we can end with that? we haven't talked about that. you would want Women who might feel like they are there, uneducated about their own finances? are they're afraid about what their life might look like post divorce? Any parting words of advice?

Speaker 3:

My, my belief is that, and really what I've seen to be true over all these years, is that the more information you have, the better decisions, the more confident and the more empowered you're going to be. And so take those little steps, start to educate yourself, get more involved with the finances, And I will also say, build a team. You know we any of these situations whether it's a separation or divorce, or your spouse, you know, passed away having a team in place is going to help you navigate this and come out on the other end as emotionally whole and as financially whole as possible.

Speaker 2:

Those are great words of wisdom. Thank you so much, stacy. We will have all of your contact information in our show notes and as well as links to Savvy Lady and to Francis Financial. So, again, i would highly encourage anyone listening to check out those resources, because they are fantastic and everyone benefits from your passions, stacy.

Speaker 3:

Well, thank you so much.

Speaker 1:

Thank you for listening to the Wealthy After Divorce podcast. You can find more information on Melissa Freidenberg and Jackie Ressler on our website, wwwpearlplancom, as well as on our podcast website, wwwwealthyafterdivorcecom.

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Jacki Roessler, CDFA®

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Melissa Fradenburg, CDFA®️

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